Has anyone been successful with storm deep thunderstick crankbaits, and the jr version too?

Personally I have never tried the thundersticks but they have a good reputation as a fish producer.

I would wager that a fellow could take almost any crankbait into the Q and do well with it.

A few things to keep in mind.......Plastic cranks have a bigger and wider wobble than balsa lures. Hence I prefer the balsa in cooler water temps and the more aggressive wobble in warmer temps.

I am torn over lures with rattles. There are times I believe they are counterproductive. All things being equal I like them in stained or discolored water or if there is a lot of surf and wave activity. In quiet clear waters I like a quiet bait. Remember, the hooks and split rings are already making plenty of noise.

I am not familiar with the hooks on the thundersticks. If they are not sticky sharp then make them so with a small file. Avoid getting the point itself so fine that it becomes weak and actually breaks when pressure is applied. You will keep missing a lot of fish thereafter should that happen without realizing why. I sharpen so I get 4 cutting surfaces.......sort of like a diamond pattern. You could choose to trade out the hooks altogether with top of the line hooks. If I'm going to have a "dedicated" crankbait that is just going to be used for trolling I will often remove the forward hook and upsize the rear hook by one size. This makes the lure more snag resistant (you are fishing near the bottom aren't you :question) and easier on the fish and safer for you when you go to remove the lure from the fishes mouth.

Try a variety of cranks and see which one you like and how they produce. That's all part of the fun!  

thundersticks have VMC hooks which i believe is what rapala runs as well. apparently thundersticks have barbarian VMC and rapala has pyramid point VMC.

im huge on lures with rattles, especially up in the Q. schools of cisco apparently make that noise, and rattles for sure help in dingy water or when the sun isnt that bright or at night. 90% of my cranks have rattles and the rest rarely see the water.

In Fisherman had an article on cranks without rattles and they were really only used on lakes where fishing pressure is heavy and rattle lures are the main bait, so fish get turned off the lures with rattles. the fishing pressure up in the Q is minimal, so i dont view them as useful.

as for thundersticks specifically, ive used them and had some success, but i didnt really think i was getting the most out of my time in the water. i fish in north/central wisconsin and the Q and i prefer shad shaped lures. they outproduce minnow lures from my experience by a fairly healthy margin. they have a larger profile, so fish can see them more easily. they displace more water so fish feel them more easily. they have more surface area to project sound vibration, so fish hear them better.

on a more positive note, i have considered trying out storms deep jointed minnow stick. the body is a bit taller and the joint being closer to the tail makes me think this would be a really good bait.

Thanks, good input. I actually did pick up a number of thundersticks so i'm asking after the fact here. I feel it was a was a compromise for sure as most of the hard baits i've used have been rapalas, and shallow divers at that. It's been almost exclusively soft baits for years now. For various reasons, my small collection of divers is but a shadow of it's former glory and to replenish with balsa is prohibitive (buying for 2). The ones i have have both types of trebles, maybe the mfg date or model make the diff. Didn't know it till now but storm is a wholly owned subsidiary of rapala and that's a plus for me at least. One annoying thing is that the box mentions "deep" but doesn't define. I know depth changes drastically with speed, line type and distance but i kinda like to see " 20' or 30' " on the box anyway. ok another look on the web shows these are rated 10-24 feet.

what color patterns did you end up getting?

the original thunderstick, or the madflash paint patterns?

yep that's the diff. the larger madflash has the barbarian trebles. all the rest not. oh and (sorry dude) the madflash is trout pattern, others are original pattern natural perch and silver scale. also got wiggle warts in brown craw and silver scale.

those all sound like good choices for colors, except... the trout... personal issue with that one, just ask MT ;)

I hate to break this to you Jax.........but somebody has to so it might as well be me. There is a percentage, howbeit very small, of trout who are evil. These trout need and deserve to be punished.

So do what I do..........when I'm reeling in that fat laker or marble eye on my trout colored crankbait I just say to myself......."you had it coming bub.........you deserve to have gotten eaten because of what you did to aunt Clara".

That is my advice. Your mind will remain free and clear of any guilt. It is also quite surprising how the size of the fish being caught seem to be in direct proportion to the guilt pangs you may feel of feeding little imitation trouts into the maws of the denizens of the deep. In fact, when I see my trout colored crankbait I get a warm fuzzy feeling all over  ;).  

jr thundersticks have worked very well on SB. Typically cast (they cast well with a longer rod and no more than 8# test, usually use 6#) to rock piles and around mid lake humps and saddles between islands. Also in swift water below falls and rapids. I have had good success trolling deep thundersticks in @ 15' along rocky shorelines for walleye early and late in the day. I am partial to the perch pattern. Better take a few because NP seem to like them very well and will do a good bit of damage to the lure. Battle scarred thundersticks bring back good memories. Presentation depends on time of year/water temp. Report back on your results.

J

jaximus wrote on May 24^th, 2011 at 9:13pm:

those all sound like good choices for colors, except... the trout... personal issue with that one, just ask MT ;)

yeah that's why the "sorry dude". if i'm a predator looking for a  baitfish, a baby bass is a hot dog and the trout a juicy brat. i really wonder how much difference is noticed between the shad pattern and trout, the difference is very subtle.

JChief wrote on May 25^th, 2011 at 12:12pm:

jr thundersticks have worked very well on SB. Typically cast (they cast well with a longer rod and no more than 8# test, usually use 6#) to rock piles and around mid lake humps and saddles between islands. Also in swift water below falls and rapids. I have had good success trolling deep thundersticks in @ 15' along rocky shorelines for walleye early and late in the day. I am partial to the perch pattern. Better take a few because NP seem to like them very well and will do a good bit of damage to the lure. Battle scarred thundersticks bring back good memories. Presentation depends on time of year/water temp. Report back on your results. J

I'm on board with everything Chief has to say. Good advice. I too am partial to a long rod with 6lb test. You can generally make a nice long cast with such outfits. I also like the perch pattern near the bottom early and late on rocky shorelines for Mr. marble-eye. And yes, the pike are quite partial to a perch pattern crank on 6lb test. Probably the only difference is I'll fish deeper starting July 1st and focus on 25 to 29 ft of water for the walleyes even right at dark.

i tend to put firetiger and natural perch pattern in the same boat when it comes to color choices. both are quite similar with firetiger being more obnoxious and triggering an aggressive response and perch bringing out the more finicky or seasoned fish that want something very natural. with that said, my tackle box contains more firetiger cranks than perch pattern ones by a margin of 14:2. the perch ones spend nearly all of their time collecting dust in the tray because i only really ever use them in SUPER clear water. because the two patterns are so similar, the firetiger is my choice in dingy water, stained water, at night, or at dawn.

sometimes i think that i might over analyze what baits i use. when it comes to choosing between perch or firetiger, i go with firetiger because more fish should be able to see it. what are your thoughts?

I judge every lure and every presentation by how big fish react to it. I hope that doesn't make me some sort of snob. The bigger fish are just more of a challenge is all I guess.

As per Chiefs post earlier in this thread..........you are quite likely to have faster action and catch more "eater" size walleyes in 15' from July onward. Personally, I find the big boys are quite a bit deeper for the most part.

So do cranks with rattles catch lots of fish? Yup.........but how many really big ones? The same with firetiger vs. natural. In my book (and I could be wrong) if you want to catch lots of mediums throw a smallish rattling firetiger crankbait. Want the big boys? Throw a big quiet perch or a trout. But like I said, I could be wrong.....and in fact there will be times my choice is the wrong choice given the conditions.

I will add one caveat.........I love firetiger for big northerns [smiley=thumbup.gif]

Sometimes I do tend to repeat myself :P  

mastertangler wrote on May 25^th, 2011 at 9:14pm:

I love firetiger for big northerns [smiley=thumbup.gif]

Seems Northerns are especially interested in lures with a bit of red/orange. Firetiger cranks seem to take more NP than other colors patterns in my experience. One of my favorites for grass snakes is a Mepps Musky Killer with orange Colorado blades and black and red skirt. Love to fish them for fun.

J

dont get me wrong, im not against natural patterns. when i do find myself looking for a natural, i always end up turning to silver. whenever i use live bait, mainly minnows, i have great success on 3-4 inch shiners. my largest walleyes have all come on soft plastics (i fish them 75% of the time i would guess so the numbers are skewed) and the next few came on silver shiners. so it only follows when i reach for a natural pattern crank i look for silver. i find it a little more attractive and reflective so its easier to see.

this year during our trip, i plan to do a lot more walleye targeted trolling than previous years. that means staying out well past dark and running cranks over the reefs and deep areas near dropoffs. i picked up a few new cranks for this application to give myself more variety in coloration and rattle/no rattle. previously my arsenal for this style of trolling was a blue/silver shad body x rap XRS8, firetiger shad rap SR7, deep down husky jerk gold DHJ10, a parrot shad rap, and a glass ghost x rap XRD08.

since then, i have added... a moss shiner x rap XRS08, purpledescent shad rap SR07, a hot tiger shad rap SR09, a silver blue shad rap SRRS07, a firetiger trolls to minnow 15ft, firetiger tail dancer 20ft, and a scheels pro pack of flicker shads in yellow perch, hot tiger, and firetiger.

Are you tripping in July Jax or getting married in July (or maybe both! :) ) I can't remember.

Should we get into some fine details.............? Why not, it is a forum after all. My disclaimer is thus......I might be wrong ;)

I like your lure selection but mostly for casting purposes. I know darn tootin well that a lot of damage can be done with shad raps but agin I like them for casting or perhaps trolling in june.

If your going in July or later where's the big lures? Where's the lures that hit 25'? One thing I have learned about the fish in the savage north......they like it big.  

our trip is july 6th-13th and the wedding is august 13th.

i troll those same baits but let out a bit more line to get them to dive those few extra feet. i run 15/4 powerpro and 14/6 fireline, so you can get some pretty deep lures by letting out a little more line. i usually dont go deeper than the 25' range with cranks, however. beyond that, they put a bit too much stress on my equipment for my taste. i did get my hands on some keel weights for this year to sink my J11 down into that range if i paddle slow enough.

i had a red tiger 30' tail dancer, but i ran it aground so many times that the lip began to curl under and i think it was running more as a modified 25'er. i couldnt handle seeing my rod curl in half so much and then bounce and load up on bottom like that. after all, i spend so much time with my rods its almost like they are my babies.

Are you running straight power pro to the lure? Any leader?

It would be interesting to me to troll side by side with you for comparison sake. I think if you are running straight power pro to the lure it is costing you some big ones. But again that is just my bias and conjecture and without trolling side by side with the same lure I have only my suspicion to base it on. And of course you wouldn't know either. A dozen 8lb'ers could of swam up to your plug and turned away at the last second due to line visibility and you would be no wiser.

First you don't want to hurt the little trouts and now your worried about banging your lure on the bottom. This is a side of you I hadn't expected. The future Mrs. Jax is a lucky lady to have such a tender hearted fellow ;).

Jax:
Suggest you purchase some shares of Rapala stock as well given your lure selection.

J

I like the cranks with rattles for larger walleye when fishing the windward shore or windward side of a reef.  The size I use is more of a function of the depth I want to reach.  Usually in these conditions the fish are up shallower, less than 15' for the most part.

I think the rattles help the fish notice my lure better in the noisier conditions I find where the wind is pounding the waves against a shoreline or reef top.  I've boated a lot of 4+ lb. walleye with a midsized Lightnin' Shad deep runner (no longer in production, unfortunately).  Believe me, I went on a spending spree when they got discontinued and started to hit the bargain bin to clear them out.  I think I hit every tackle store in a 20 mile radius.  ;D  

I'm usually running it in the bottom 2-3 feet of the water column.  As long as I bang bottom occasionally, I know I'm hitting the right depth.

Color, to me, is almost the last thing I'll consider.  Sometimes it can matter a lot but often it's much more about lure action and depth.  My partner and I will switch baits and colors a lot until we find the hot lure for the conditions, never running the same lure or color as the other until we gradually dial in on the lure of the moment.

For sure, the warmer the water the more I tend to use baits with rattles.  When the water temp has the fish active, the rattles will call 'em in from a good distance for a look-see.  When the water is colder, I tend to go with balsa baits a lot more and slow down.

On a few occasions, we've found it effective to have one rattling crank on and a balsa bait on the other line.  Seems like the rattler wakes them up and the balsa sticks 'em.  When we both go to balsa, the bite dies off.  Doesn't happen often though.

@MT, i usually run 8 inch invisileaders by southbend with black hardware. sometimes ill run powerpro straight to the hypersnaps. (i have red powerpro and i usually fish in lakes with a bit of murk to the water) on the fireline rods (smoke fireline) i run invisileaders as well. i was experimenting with just snaps this spring and had a 50" range muskie slice my 14lb fireline on the bait inhale. i was sight fishing and had him hit on a 4" ringworm... its frustrating because sometimes my scissors dont even want to cut the stuff.

i want to experiment with a 2-3 foot fluorocarbon leader this year but for that i want to wait till after dark when the pike but really shuts down.

as for running my lures on the bottom, i really only am comfortable with taildancers hitting bottom because they have a very solid bill section although i did curl that one under pretty well. the rest of the lures just seem too  lightly constructed on the bills leading edge to grind on rock. i cringe everytime i hit bottom, then hold my breath in hopes of a strike. i ran the first ever rapala i owned into the bottom and broke the lip off of the perch pattern original floater.

@JChief... is it sad that i have, in my written budget, $10 a week set aside for fishing lures?

@Snow_Dog, i completely agree with the one rattler and one silent one. thats how my boat buddy and have i have trolled the past 5 trips up there. usually the rattle one gets the hits for us though

jaximus wrote on May 26^th, 2011 at 5:27pm:

@JChief... is it sad that i have, in my written budget, $10 a week set aside for fishing lures?

That is VERY sad.  :'(  It's not nearly enough!  

Better go back and crunch the numbers again.

it took a lot of brown nosing and housework to get it that high even! considering i still am searching for a full time job after graduation (last weekend), my job at the university doesnt pay overly well.

You know Jax I don't really lose as many lures to pike as you might think. Hard baits can be a little different than soft plastics where they seem to just inhale everything and nip you off. I probably catch 70% of my pike bites that pop a crank. Perhaps it is because I am partial to a longish crank especially for walleyes. Although my fav fell out of production (the large fat rap in perch on 6 lb test).

SD made a ton of good points IMHO. Being aware of how much noise is generated by waves and surf can effect lure choice for sure.

Invisileaders.......is that an oxymoron? I want you to have 3 lures that you are willing to "expend", no leader! Preferably large deep divers. I trolled last summer the first week of July on Basswood day and night. I lost zero (as in 0) lures to pike using 6 and 8lb mono exclusively. My average walleye was right at 5lbs. I caught very few under 4lbs and my biggest was 6.5..........The point being you can fish for walleye or you can fish for pike but it's counterproductive IMO to try and cover all your bases with the addition of a leader for fear of losing a lure.

Now what's up with using FC at night? Then you can get by with rope for line. I usually tie a uni knot for my FC to Power pro connection but it can be rather delicate work in the lighter pound tests. Plus without the stretch of a long piece of mono which acts like a shock absorber, it's surprising how easily a 3' section of light FC will part ways with you. On my last off shore trip a guy turned me onto a knot called a "slim beauty". I liked it very much. Looks to be supreme. I was tying it with 80lb test........I will be interested to experiment with it on lighter line. Check it out.

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Quote:

it took a lot of brown nosing and housework to get it that high even!

I'm afraid to ask what it takes for a canoe trip :-?
Hopefully she shares that passion.
You need to change the balance of power ;D
For every new pair of shoes she gets, you get a percentage of there cost in fishing gear.
At the cost of womens shoes, you'll still come out ahead ;)

against all my instincts, i will try trolling without a wire leader and try a fluorocarbon or mono leader. its not just pike, but also snags. with powerpro/fireline you can generally pull the lure free by bending the hooks or getting unhooked from the log/rocks. i dont know if mono/fluoro could do that.

she promised to never touch the canoe trip because its a 'tradition.' she likes the outdoors, fishing and canoeing, but cant do it for as many hours on end as i can.

i actually have tried the % of shoe money for fishing stuff. i got a big old 'yeah right' as she bought her wedding shoes on my card.

Quote:

she promised to never touch the canoe trip because its a 'tradition.' she likes the outdoors, fishing and canoeing, but cant do it for as many hours on end as i can.   i actually have tried the % of shoe money for fishing stuff. i got a big old 'yeah right' as she bought her wedding shoes on my card.   Back to top

I'd get that " promise" in writing and witnessed by a notary public.
I suggest you contact Wally, and get yourself another card, since she has access to yours now.
It's called a MAN-CARD. You can tuck it away in your wallet for when the honeymoon is over and she wants "new" traditions to take the place of " old ones" ::)

Women are easy peasy Jax. Just warm the massage oil in the microwave (be sure to test it) and while your rubbing her back start talking about all the things you want or are going to do. If your not to fast, you can have what ever lures you want or go on just about any trip you want............."but honey you said just last night that it would be OK, don't you remember" :).

Works every time ;).

Oh, and don't listen to ST, he'll just get you into trouble ;D.

my brothers say that she already stole my man-card...

but more on topic, all of this fishing chat has really got my mind running about my trip this year. its only 41 days away. the countdown has begun. to make it even more anticipated, im picking up my new canoe tomorrow.

earlier i mentioned my concern for the lips of lures breaking off from running into bottom. apparently this guy was having similar issues but with a specific model of crank

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ive never used that crank before, but from my experience with thundersticks, their lip is substantial enough to make it through running aground

Don't let that dissuade you from using the flat raps. A very impressive lure. If you snap your wrists on the retrieve this lure has a sideways flash that is unbeatable. With it's wide profile it fishes much "bigger" than its 4.5" length would indicate. I usually tie an improved clinch or a gryp knot with the minnow style rapalas and position the knot on a 30 degree angle downward for a nice roll but with the flat rap it wants a lot of freedom to get that erratic side to side action when you snap your wrists so a fas snap is the way to go.   (You need to Login or Register (large size......still small)

ive been curious about those things. i wondered if anyone has had good/bad experience with them. for trolling plugs and tossing cranks, you dont really need a swivel, so those would cut down on the clutter around the lure.

Edited by kingfisher: See new topic about
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