I enjoy Quetico trips primarily for the fishing and I enjoy moving from lake to lake for change of scenery and fishery (ie I do not want to base camp).  I have done Quetico trips in the past and this year did my first fly-in outpost cabin - I enjoyed the fishing, wilderness, and camping more in Quetico.

HOWEVER, for those of us with precious little vacation time (me), those of with medical limitations that make portages even more difficult (other family members of mine), and we limited on our trip routes and how remote we can get into the park (even when we use ultra-light outfitted packages). 

We have in years past explored guide options.  What we really want is more of a "sherpa" - ideally our family members would be in the same canoes together, while another canoe of "sherpas" paddles ahead to set up camp, dinner, cleaning, and the heavy lifting on portages.  This would afford our group the opportunity to more effectively utilize the very limited time we have to spend together in a given year.

Money is not a problem for this group and we really Quetico wilderness over other high-quality fishing options (ie, fly-in/outpost/lodge). 

I have done some searching and heard of a few options - LLC First Nation is one - I'm not even sure if they are still licensed to operate, but I dont like the idea of the motors and live bait.  Has anyone heard of any other options? 

Please only constructive replies...I dont want to hear about "portages are part of the experiences" or "pack lighter" or "base camp".  I've done plenty of portages, we already pack light (we used ultralight outfitting packages), and we are not interested in basecamping.

Try Piragis. They once offered something like this - iirc it was based around food and chefs but they leaped to my mind when I read your post.

I will say from a purely practical point of view, if all your packs are in the sherpa canoe, yours are without ballast which I find necessary. Just be prepared. Maybe three in a normally two man canoe overcomes that and saves portaging canoes - assuming the sherpa is ahead of you.

I'll do it.  I have 2 boys that would help as well.  Seriously.  Lets keep in touch.

As someone in a similar situation, you post interests me.  What struck me very vividly was what you wanted your sherpas to do. I see a big difference between sherpas that help on portages and sherpas that do camp chores.  In the former case, you are talking assistance born of necessity.  Physical limitations make such activities problematic.

But for camp chores, I guess my reaction may be along the lines of what you asked not to hear.  Is taking 5 min to set up a tent an issue?  Isn't setting up camp part part of the effective bonding time that is part of the trip? The scenario you described to me sounded like "glamping", not only with sherpas but servants.  I would think in that kind of environment, there would be two separate groups camping together; the staff and the customers.  I know your intention is to bond with family, but wouldn't it be nice of some interesting strangers were part of one group camping together.

Regardless of who is in what canoe, lets say you stayed together as a group.  For every two people, I will assume there are two heavy bags, one day bag, some hand carries, and a canoe.  Each sherpa double portages, canoe/heavy one trip and heavy/hand the next.  Each non-sherpa single portages taking just a day bag. You travel as a group and all contribute to camp, but as in any group, the camp contributions may vary according to preference and abilities.

Azalea - not looking for glamping by any means. This is purely to facilitate going deeper into the park than we would otherwise go (by alleviating physical strain) and allowing for more fishing time.

Setting up a tent definitely takes longer than 5 minutes. Camp chores in general consume a large portion of time (I'd estimate at least a third of the trip is spent on chores).  Paying someone to help gives them a paid trip into quetico (hopefully you'd have someone who enjoys it anyway) and gives you more fishing time and deeper access into the park then you might otherwise get (if that's what you're looking for). Could be a win-win for the right people.

Some fly-ins can cost over $2k/person and you aren't even that remote (there might be 2 dozen other people with you, or by yourself on a smaller Lake that sees a different group every week). If you have 6 people that's a lot of money combined to spend relative to the cost of a typical self-guided quetico trip. I would assume you could find help and in total spend the same or even potentially less.

PhantomJug, I may be in touch in the future.

Does anyone know the legality of just hiring an individual? Do "guides" require licenses to operate in quetico (based on my reading I think the answer is yes). What is the definition of a guide and does the definition contemplate the hiring of help separate from what is typically understood as "guide" services?

John,
It appears you are the one doing all the camp chores for your 5 person group size. Do you have a choice in the matter? Azalea's point about the 5 min tent set suggests that camp chores equally divided should not take so much time. An efficient camp with all hands on board should not employ more than 2 hours work. If you're willing to share some detail of the daily routine, some time savers could be suggested.
-YB

Kids and grandkids make great Sherpas. Don't make it sound like work, because it's fun and everyone is big enough to help. :)

I believe there is some sort of regulation regarding guides but not sure what. Pretty sure the Scout base uses the term ranger for the staffer that goes withveach group because of this. I may be corrected.

BTW,Gerald Patterson's A Guide's Tale describes guiding in the BWCAW in a much earlier era, but as I recall what they did is close to what you are looking for. Too bad you can't still take the train to Winton.

I don't know the guide regulations or if it is allowed to pay an individual to be your "sherpa," but I would be concerned about the tax situation. If you end up paying someone from the US to provide you services in Canada, your sherpa may end up in a tax situation they didn't anticipate - having to file a Canadian income tax return and making the US return much more complicated. Paying the accountants might end up costing more than you would pay them to help you out. I would expect that an outfitting business would already know the things they have to do, but an individual just doing it might not be aware of the implications. I'm not an expert in international taxes, so I can't offer any more insights than this (such as how much you can pay/earn before having to file and stuff like that), but it is something to keep in mind.

2015 gift tax exclusion is $14,000. Where do I sign up?

I still think just ask your outfitter. I'm sure this is not first time.

Quote:

I would be concerned about the tax situation.

This reminds of an incident I had a few years ago, which might relate to what one might say to authorities in this situation. I was driving from Seattle to Vancouver where I was going to give a talk at an academic conference. When I went through Canadian customs, they asked my plans and when I told them they agent got very "interested". He asked what I was getting paid and I replied, nothing.  He did not buy that, so he directed me to the building up ahead with the yellow light, where I went in and got the third degree.  Evidently Canadian customs is very  sensitive to Americans crossing the border to work in Canada, regardless the sum of money involved.

azalea wrote on Aug 18^th, 2015 at 2:31pm:

Quote: I would be concerned about the tax situation. This reminds of an incident I had a few years ago, which might relate to what one might say to authorities in this situation. I was driving from Seattle to Vancouver where I was going to give a talk at an academic conference. When I went through Canadian customs, they asked my plans and when I told them they agent got very "interested". He asked what I was getting paid and I replied, nothing.  He did not buy that, so he directed me to the building up ahead with the yellow light, where I went in and got the third degree.  Evidently Canadian customs is very  sensitive to Americans crossing the border to work in Canada, regardless the sum of money involved.

That is a true fact. Any American worker needs to have a work permit. Say anything about working on anything and the questions come flying at you.

I can see a true need for a service like this. As ailments prevent many from performing the tasks necessary in canoe tripping we will see more requests like this. The same service could be used by those that want to pay someone to portage gear and run the camp so they do not have to.

A friend flew in and joined my last trip for the final 17 days. Medical conditions beyond his control would have kept him in a basecamp. We had a great journey from Irvine Lake in WCPP out to Wallace Lake in Manitoba. The value "priceless," the total bill "not a chance."

Quote:

I can see a true need for a service like this. As ailments prevent many from performing the tasks necessary in canoe tripping we will see more requests like this. The same service could be used by those that want to pay someone to portage gear and run the camp so they do not have to.

I agree, but with fewer and fewer young people getting into outdoor type activities where are those  "Sherpa"s" going to come from?

I see fewer and fewer young people every trip. :(

Maybe the middle-age guys can help the older "seasoned" paddlers for now, but eventually we'll need new young blood to make the idea work long term, or I would think so at least. :-/

why don't you ask atikokan outfitters if they would provide the services you want - I'd suspect that for the right fees, they could find sherpas for you - try CanoeCanada.com  adn see what they have to say.  if they don't do that, maybe they know of someone who will

more or less as a an "assistant guide" (we didn't pitch people's tents, but did everyting else - no portaging involved, especially with a 400# freighter canoe), I used to work for a canoe outfitter in Colorado - he paid me a $100 per day - you could expect to pay at least that for each of one or two "sherpas" i'd think, and likely a lot more

This is the most depressing thread I have ever read here. The only people still interested in going to the Q are too lame to even set up camp and there are no young people who want to go or even work as paid Sherpa's?  Isn't this BWJ Stu's whole gig? And does he pay the taxes on labor performed in Canada by a US citizen? Do we need handicapped access entry points with means to access the remote areas for those who can not do it conventionally? When I get to the point I can no longer go Q tripping because of physical limitations I will just move on to other pursuits, but if I ask such a pathetic question on this forum as start6ed this thread, please come and hit me with a bowling pin as I obviously am developing dementia.
Jon

would it have to be a bowling pin? that's pretty specific.

Jon wrote on Aug 20^th, 2015 at 2:18am:

... please come and hit me with a bowling pin as I obviously am developing dementia. Jon

Now that's something I might sign up for!!

;D ;D ;D

Jon wrote on Aug 20^th, 2015 at 2:18am:

This is the most depressing thread I have ever read here. Jon

There are some other threads that would better take this title.

There isn't much to go on, but it seems that either he takes on the task of this group or he doesn't go.  Being the mule for a group trying to move 10 miles every day, 3 in and 3 out is not going to leave much time for locating some quality fishing, which is what the objective is.

What's depressing is the fuss about the tax laws.  What better time to play the dumb card?

No need to kill the thread.

-YB

Maybe some modification of the trip plan might work out a little better for all concerned "Sherpa’s" included.
Maybe fly-in/ tow in to one of the lakes the Native Peoples have boats on and set a base-camp as far away from the landing site as possible.
You could plan your base-camp and day fishing lakes using this tool here:

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That way you can set a nice camp and not have to worry about breaking down and moving all the time.

Then plan day-trips to lakes all around the base-camp lake.

While the Sherpa’s are running the empty canoes/day packs across ,the others can be fishing until it's their turn to cross over.

3 in and 3 out and multiple camp moves leaves little time for just fishing and will put a lot of strain/stress on the Sherpa’s trying to please their clients.

Yellowbird wrote on Aug 22^nd, 2015 at 2:53pm:

Being the mule for a group trying to move 10 miles every day, 3 in and 3 out is not going to leave much time for locating some quality fishing, . .

Well, maybe for some people . . . .  ;)

PhantomJug wrote on Aug 22^nd, 2015 at 5:56pm:

Yellowbird wrote on Aug 22nd, 2015 at 2:53pm: Being the mule for a group trying to move 10 miles every day, 3 in and 3 out is not going to leave much time for locating some quality fishing, . . Well, maybe for some people . . . .  ;)

Yeah, I swear, Kingfisher's fishing rod behaves more like a divining rod.  It starts twitching and bending even when we're sitting in camp.