I'm in the market for a new pair of boots for long canoe trips with serious portaging.  I'd be wearing them all day, so I'm looking for something that drains well and and provides good ankle support and traction for those rough portages.  Does anyone have any experience with the Chota Quetico Trekker?  Other recommendations?  Thanks!

Welcome aboard to QJ! We just enjoyed a great time in Madison last weekend! I hope you will join us next year. ;)

To answer your question, I like the NRS Storm boot. It is everything you are looking for. What size do you want? 8-)

What is serious portaging?  :-?  After 30 years and over 500 nights in Quetico, the best thing I've worn on my feet are an old pair of comfortable sneakers (do we still use that term?).  But then again, maybe I'm not doing serious portaging?

I tried Chotas when they first came out and the traction on wet rocks was poor. Several slips and near misses. I "retired" them and would not buy again unless the sole material/traction has greatly improved.

Welcome Mooseboy...now I have this picture of Bullwinkle running around my head.  I own and have used all the boots below as noted on Quetico trips of 10 days. 

NRS - According to the NRS site the Storm Boot is discontinued/no longer available. I have no experience with them.  I do have the NRC Velocity, which is on closeout from NRS for $82.50.  The NRS rep at Canoecopia told me they are making some updates to the boot (could be same with the Storm?).  He noted my comments on it.  My experience was that it fit well, super comfortable and light, drains great, great traction, lugged and siped sole.  Downsides - open cell neoprene takes FOREVER to dry and the toe cap could have been sturdier.  Looking forward to the updates.

Chota - Have an OLD pair of Trekkers.  I thought they were very good, very sturdy, drain well.  They have replaced the sole with a lugged grippier one - saw it at 'Copia too.  They run large and I added Superfeet insoles - the ones that come with tend to float around.  Also look at the new Hybrid Hightop Rubber Soled Boot - bought a pair a 'Copia and looking to see how well they work - have the same new sole.  They should drain like water from a bucket with all that mesh.  Rep said the mesh held up extremely well in testing and field trials. 

Astral - I used the Rassler last summer on two trips.  Ultra light, super drainage, fastest drying shoe I ever had, very comfortable, SUPER sticky soles. Downsides - semi-low ankle height, no screens let in muck/sand, sole is a bit thin.  The Astral rep at 'Copia said they are making some updates including a composite shank, mesh, and adding a sole like the TR-1's.  Overall good, but a bit lightweight.  I'd wait for the updated version.

Sorel Woodbine Surplus Boot - Discontinued, but still available new from some places.  All canvas with leather rand, high top lace ups, no drain ports, but the canvas doesn't need them.  Sturdy, lightweight, ran a bit small. Decent grip. Should be able to get a deal on them.  No major complaints.

Still looking for that ultimate boot.  Good luck and post additional questions.

pd

I wear some Teva shoes made of a mesh stretchy material. Those with some Smart Wool socks are all I need. Easy to wash and rinse out in camp, and dry by the morning.

shoe review at
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This is the shoe that Pine Knot wore.  Maybe he'll chime in for a review. Baffin Swamp Buggy
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It gets high marks for a creative name.  ;D

I like my Chota Trekkers. I have been using them for 16 years and only had to replace them once. I actually wear one pair for portaging and another pair around camp.

THE SHOES I LIKE SO WELL ARE THE
KEEN MEN'S VOYAGEUR MID

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I love my Chota Caneyforks. A little taller than the trekkers and at the time I purchased more tread.

BillConner wrote on Mar 16^th, 2017 at 1:05pm:

I love my Chota Caneyforks. A little taller than the trekkers and at the time I purchased more tread.

I hope you're right, BillConner.  That was my "big purchase" at Copia.  I liked the tread on the Caney Forks.  Also, they run a little big which allowed a nice combo possible with my Chota neoprene gaiters.

jp's comment about the basic neoprene Chota boots reflects my experience with them, as well.  Very little tread, especially on inclining/declining gritty, gravelly wet rock faces.  They do well enough to keep your feet dry but don't expect any real support or traction on challenging surfaces.

My long-term solution to portaging has been the OTB Abyss Storm Boots.  They worked just fine under the most grueling circumstances... with just one problem.  The laces would constantly come apart, rendering the boot fit very loose.  On one bad-ass 3 mile bushwhack with Kingfisher several years ago I develop severe blood blisters and lost 3 toe nails as a result.  You simply can't drop heavy loads and tie & re-tie your boot laces when you are in a swamp or climbing steep ridges.  Solotripper eventually solved that problem for me by recommending those push-button lace binders (can't recall the name for those gizmos). 

Anyway, my OTB's finally rotted out under the duress of many years.  The Caney Forks appeared to be a good solution (see:   (You need to Login or Register ).  The Copia "discount" and the fact that they came equipped with those lace-binder/quick-lace devices helped persuade me.  We'll see.

Good protection is essential to ensuring a happy experience where challenging terrain can be rugged on your feet and ankles!

Jimbo   8-)

  I buy discounted "water" shoes from someplace like Sierra Trading Post. Remember to buy a shoe at LEAST a 1 size bigger or more than your street shoes to accommodate heavy socks/ neoprene gators.
   
I think a sticky traction sole for wet rock is key as well as light and comfortable, TOE bumper too.

I also like CORD LOCK's on shoelaces so you don't have loops to catch on roots.

I think ankle support is over-rated in that it's your muscle/tendon strength that supports your foot/ankle action.

Now ankle IMPACT protection is another thing. You see plenty of NBA players wearing low-cut shoes now and they twist and turn their ankles with more sheer force than we will on a portage.

Now IF you have a previous ankle injury from sports/accident and have actual physical damage then a higher boot laced tight or one of those slip on ankle/foot braces might be needed.

  I don't think there IS one perfect boot because everyone is a different size, the  load they carry, body weight, the way the walk, all play a part.

Traction on the other hand, is pretty well a constant.

IF you have "weak" ankles that are NOT orthopedic injury related ( like pins in ankle), get yourself a cheap WOBBLE balance board. You can find buying/info exercises on-line.

Remember indigenous people around the world carry loads like the old time Voyager's on mountain goat terrain for hours wearing little tire tread sandals or barefoot.

I'm NOT saying a higher/stiffer boot is bad, but there is a tradeoff in weight/comfort/drying and you might be better served with a good sole and a little "work-out" routine for you ankles/lower extremities.

  There are also numerous ways to lace a shoe or boot to keep it on your foot in muddy conditions and give more lateral support too. All can be found on-line with a Google search.

Quote:

Solotripper eventually solved that problem for me by recommending those push-button lace binders (can't recall the name for those gizmos).

I use these and replace ALL my outdoor shoelaces with Paracord which these CORD LOCKS are best on.
I bought these on Amazon, made by FMS. 10 IN Pkg. Best price I've found.

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solotripper wrote on Mar 16^th, 2017 at 2:14pm:

I think ankle support is over-rated in that it's your muscle/tendon strength that supports your foot/ankle action. Now ankle IMPACT protection is another thing. You see plenty of NBA players wearing low-cut shoes now and they twist and turn their ankles with more sheer force than we will on a portage. Now IF you have a previous ankle injury from sports/accident and have actual physical damage then a higher boot laced tight or one of those slip on ankle/foot braces might be needed.   I don't think there IS one perfect boot because everyone is a different size, the  load they carry, body weight, the way the walk, all play a part.

I agree with ST's assessment re: ankles.  That's why PJ's approach, "sneakers" (and ,yes, that's how I still refer to them, too), works for some folks.

That's also why it DOESN'T work for me.  I broke/sprained each of my ankles so many times playing basketball in my younger days that I lost count.  I remember 4 casts but it might have been 6.  I only bothered with them when something was truly "broken"... and usually I broke the cast off after 3-4 weeks (which probably explains my frequent ankle issues, but I was anxious to get back out & "play ball").

Anyway, I haven't broken them in about 30 years and don't wish to get into that habit again.  "High top" sneaks, alone, won't do it for me.  I usually played ball with so many wraps around my ankles that it looked like I was afflicted with elephantiasis!

ST is right.  The best footwear is not a one-size/brand-fits-all-situations solution.  I envy PJ's healthy ankles and ST's aboriginals who took better care of their feet than I did back when it mattered.

Jimbo   8-)

Since I tend to only go very early or late in the season I use Muck boots, and like them, but they'd be too hot for warm weather trips IMO. Not much ankle support but dry and a nice lug sole w/steel shank. All is good till you go over the top, and that'll happen. When that happens a sense of humor helps. I'm not sure there is a "perfect" boot.

I had the OTBs till they finally rotted away. But I did notice the mess let in fine grit that added to wearing away the neoprene socks I used in the heal area. i also noted the neoprene booties seemed to stay wet and the evaporative cooling effect made for cold feet, equal to just wet footing it w/wool socks IMO. I tried Sealskins and pretty much the same, foot sweat and/or wet outer layer made for cold feet.

I had a visit from a pair of Q park rangers once and noticed they wore what I'd call '70's era Army Jungle boots, part leather, part nylon, and they had cut a few holes into them to help with drainage. It was early Sept and they were wet footing it. Probably very cheap at a Army Surplus store.

IMO even if you get wet feet and it's cold, it's not too bad as long as you have dry socks and shoes for camp. You may need to dress your torso a bit warmer. I'm pretty sure that's what the park rangers were doing.

Quote:

I had a visit from a pair of Q park rangers once and noticed they wore what I'd call '70's era Army Jungle boots, part leather, part nylon, and they had cut a few holes into them to help with drainage. It was early Sept and they were wet footing it. Probably very cheap at a Army Surplus store.

  IF I were going to wear a higher boot, I would pick up a pair of these Viet Nam jungle boots with the PANAMA mud shedding sole and give them a try.

They only came in FULL sizes and it used to be only a D width, but I have seen ones that came in Narrow and Wide (E ?) widths, made by Goverment contractors to the original military specs. Under $50.



  I had a pair once in my early canoe days, but one of my old canoe buddies under the influence forgot the uppers were NYLON and while I was asleep set them to close to fire. :o Made it thru trip but they were shot.

  I just read that the military is testing a new all purpose combat boot and it will be very similar to the Viet Nam boot but will have better drainage that will let water out but keep sand from coming in.

In a few years THAT might be the boot to have IF you want a hi-cut boot.

Just a few of the options. Some come in WIDE widths.
Just remember that if they're built to military specs they are built tougher than most CIVILIAN sport type footwear.

The ones made in the USA are the best and the most expensive. The difference is the sole on cheaper one is glued the expensive one stitched.

That may or may not be an issue for you?


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Jimbo wrote on Mar 16^th, 2017 at 1:57pm:

BillConner wrote on Mar 16th, 2017 at 1:05pm: I love my Chota Caneyforks. A little taller than the trekkers and at the time I purchased more tread. I hope you're right, BillConner.  That was my "big purchase" at Copia.  I liked the tread on the Caney Forks.  Also, they run a little big which allowed a nice combo possible with my Chota neoprene gaiters. jp's comment about the basic neoprene Chota boots reflects my experience with them, as well.  Very little tread, especially on inclining/declining gritty, gravelly wet rock faces.  They do well enough to keep your feet dry but don't expect any real support or traction on challenging surfaces. My long-term solution to portaging has been the OTB Abyss Storm Boots.  They worked just fine under the most grueling circumstances... with just one problem.  The laces would constantly come apart, rendering the boot fit very loose.  On one bad-ass 3 mile bushwhack with Kingfisher several years ago I develop severe blood blisters and lost 3 toe nails as a result.  You simply can't drop heavy loads and tie & re-tie your boot laces when you are in a swamp or climbing steep ridges.  Solotripper eventually solved that problem for me by recommending those push-button lace binders (can't recall the name for those gizmos).  Anyway, my OTB's finally rotted out under the duress of many years.  The Caney Forks appeared to be a good solution (see:   (You need to Login or Register ).  The Copia "discount" and the fact that they came equipped with those lace-binder/quick-lace devices helped persuade me.  We'll see. Good protection is essential to ensuring a happy experience where challenging terrain can be rugged on your feet and ankles! Jimbo   8-)

I was a little disappointed my first trip - too "loose" - but I got use to using a pair of inserts and slightly heavier smatwool socks and 10 or do trips later would not change. I like the ankle support, they drain well, and I wet foot May through October.

I hope you enjoy them. I don't even think about them any longer. Now if I could get my hips and shoulders to feel as good as my feet do...

My portage boots have been limited to what I could find in duck feet wide options.  I wear a 4E (EEEE) width so I have been wearing L.L. Bean boots for years.  They work reasonable well until you go in over the top, and then they are still wet long after you are home. I have always been happy with their adhesion to rocks and wood on the trails, but admittedly without much to compare them to. 

I did buy a pair of OTB’s in a 2E several years ago, but eventually gave them away to a friend who is still using them.

I had a brief waltz with a pair of Keen sandals while wading part of McEwan Creek, but all that got me was bloody feet from sharp rocks.

Now I have just purchased a pair of Chota Caney Fork Wading Shoes at Copia.  Even though they do not call out a width, they fit surprisingly well.  The Gent who sold them to me advised to break them in wet.  Wade some water and go for a walk, then repeat.

I would be happy to hear opinions on the merits of the matching Caney Fork Breathable Waterproof Sox.  They are half the price of the boots themselves.  Paying $70 for a pair of socks sounds as ridiculous as the $64 MSR frying pan I bought last year.  I am still ashamed of myself for that one.

Regards,

Mossback

Hey Mossback,

Before I actually "purchased" my Caney Forks I had picked up from the Chota booth, I walked them over to the Piragis booth (but kept them hidden).  I KNEW they sold them in their catalog & figured to secure an additional point of view before I actually went into my wallet at check-out.  The big guy in the Piragis booth told me that, hands down, the Caney Forks were the best boot they sold and that he himself wore them (& would wear no other).  The reason I mention this is that he went on to say exactly the same thing that you were told by the Chota dealer: "break them in wet and they will 'mold' around your feet."

I guess we will find out this spring/summer whether or not this was sagely advice.

By the way, as soon as I got home, I removed the inserts and paired them my Chota "gaiters" with the neoprene sock.  It seemed like a great fit.  Again, we'll see....

FYI

Jimbo   8-)

P.S.

Mossback, I have big, wide feet too.  Nevertheless, I expect I may need to wear a 2nd pair of socks even after I re-insert the inserts while walking around camp... at least until the boots do that 'molding' thing around my feet.  Those boots DO run large.

Jimbo   8-)

I have used the water proof socks.  It is easy to sweat in them and get wet feet but my feet were still warm.  The other problem I had with them is than were thicker than the socks that worked well in the boots and that cramped my feet causing problems. My toe nails have almost grown back. 

Quote:

Nevertheless, I expect I may need to wear a 2nd pair of socks even after I re-insert the inserts while walking around camp.

  I hate to be a nay-sayer, but when you say "inserts", are you talking about the ones that have a heel cup and ARCH support molded in them?

IF so, you're robbing Peter to pay Paul foot wise.
You should ALWAYS bring the socks/booties you intend to wear IF possible when buying new footwear OR buy them big enough that you DON'T need to remove the inserts/arch supports.

  Having your arch supported under a heavy load is very important not just for your feet, but your ankles/knees and even lower back. Pain travels upward when you have bad arch support in your shoes.

  Sometimes it's hard to put those Neoprene booties in a shoe/boot because they SNAG that insert and it's a real pain. That's when many people take them out.

Since you already have the boot, try this little trick and see if it will work for you?

Put the INSERT inside the neoprene bootie with your regular sock choice and walk around a little bit to make sure the feel good, THEN see if you can get your shoe on? If so and you can lace them right, you can keep that important arch support.  ;) 8-)

Magic,  I bought a pair of SealSkinz waterproof/breathable socks last year, a size bigger than recommended and they still brought back childhood memories of Encyclopedia Britannica photos of women with "bound feet".

Short rant detour.......I wish manufacturers of socks, boots, rainsuits, etc. would stop claiming they are breathable.  Maybe they do actually pass some water vapor, but it ain't enough to stay dry.  OK, I'm better now.

Jimbo,,  You mentioned wearing 2 pair of wool socks, so can I assume you are going wet foot and using the socks for padding and some theoretical amount of warmth?

Thanks

MossBack

Mossback,

I was talking about when wearing the shoes around camp, such as when I go out to hunt for wood.  Sometimes I go deep enough that I need more than my sandals.  Until the shoes "mold" to my feet (as has been asserted), it might be that I need some "filler" to keep them tight.  I guess I won't know until the time comes.  Anyway, I wasn't thinking "warmth" so much except maybe when I would do a spring or fall trip.

ST, I have so many different types of inserts and arch support devices around for my problem feet that I have little doubt I can find something that will work with those neoprene gaiters.  Chances are I would only wear those gaiters in the spring or fall.  I don't care about having "wet feet" in the summer.  Gaiters would just be extra baggage then.

Jimbo   8-)

I wear a pair of Smartwool hiking socks in my Caneyforks May to October.

And as far as inserts, I use the pads that came with the Caneyforks. (It's my zamberlan hiking boots that have inserts.)

The breaking in molding thing, which this is first I've heard of it, explains why I was not thrilled on first trip but have grown very fond of them.

BillConner wrote on Mar 18^th, 2017 at 12:42pm:

The breaking in molding thing, which this is first I've heard of it, explains why I was not thrilled on first trip but have grown very fond of them.

Yeah, I thought it was both interesting AND notable that both the Chota & Piragis booths would independently claim the same thing.  Your actual experience gives me hope their claims will prove true.

Thanks for sharing.

Jimbo  8-)

I've been using chota boots for a number of years. Not sure what the first one's were called. Then trekkers and now on my second pair of Caney Forks.  Good boots, but I learned twice now that if they are even coming apart a little, replace them. Both times I thought I could get one more trip out of them... both times they really fell apart. Dental floss is good thread I learned in this. For me the thread doesn't hold up. I don't know if it's a China thing. Cheap steel/ cheap thread... haha. But all models of chota's I found I had to remove and replace the insert or insole whatever you call them. For me they always worked there way from below your feet. Replace with a good one, I use superfeet as someone else mentioned they did too. I wear one pair of smart wool with a liner or pull insole and wear the chota neoprene sock that goes to your knee. I'm really hard on footwear and I don't know why.

I've gotten in the habit of using seam sealer on all the exposed threads on my outdoor and work boots.

I seem's to help and is quick and easy to do.

I've sprained my left ankle at least a few hundred times.  Now it's pretty loose and I can almost always walk out a twist.  But spraining my right ankle is one of the two things I"m afraid of in the boonies (the other is appendicitis).  So I look for traction, ankle support, and lastly drainage.

I've used Cabela's Gore-Tex lined snake boots but one of them leaks.  I tried OTB Abyss boots and found they have about zero ankle support.  Now I have NRS Velocity Water Shoe and I love 'em.  They have the best ankle support I've ever found - as good as using plastic clamshell inserts that go halfway up my calf.  They don't drain all that well but I don't much care.  I could put additional drains (eyelets) in them if that was a problem.

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It looks like NRS might be discontinuing them, so get 'em while they're hot.

Dave

Oops.

I ran into these boots while reading an article about the water friendly boots the Navy SEALS have worn.

I had a pair of these back in 80's and wore them out.
Think Chuck Taylors on steroids. Reviews say they run narrow?
Only negative thing I can recall is the innersole is worthless, so you would need a nice supportive insole adjust your size for that.

I wore them for warm weather canoeing and wading while fishing.

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I've been using the same pair of Merrill Ventelator hiking boots for several years. I know that no matter what, my feet will get soaked. These boots have good drainage and dry fairly quick.

I did a test drive on my new Copia purchased Chota Caney Creek portage shoes this weekend.  Went wading the creek in knee deep water for a half mile or so.  The first thing I noticed was Portage Dog’s comment about the supplied insoles slip sliding around to the point of being annoying.  I had to purchase a bit larger size to get them wide enough, and I am sure that made the insole issue worse.  The sole’s grip on slick creek rock was pretty good, as was the ankle support.

I wore them wandering around the woods for the next 12 hours in 65 degree temps and a stiff wind and the boots or wool socks  never got close to drying out.

I have never purposely done wet foot canoeing, but this spring I will be traveling with a group where one member is bringing his own canoe and I am likely to be in it occasionally, so I want to be able to act in kind.

A couple of folks here mentioned Superfeet insoles as a help for the Caney Creeks.  Went to Amazon and the SF website and found no less than 50 options.  Would someone who has them in use care to suggest a particular model ?  They are not cheap, most in the $35 to $60 range.  So once again I would like to steal the diligent research of others.

Kind Regards,

MossBack

MB,

I've worn about every type of replacement inner-sole both in my sports shoes and work boots. Often the difference in price is ALL in the name. Truth be told like store brand items, many are made by the same vendor.

I'd try one of these Dr. Scholl's products.

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Either the WORK insole, the EXTRA support, or the
SPORT replacement. DON'T get the FULL jell sole, sounds good/feels good but won't hold up.

You can even get a COUPON to save a few bucks on them. IF you go to CVS or maybe other big chains they MIGHT have their own store brand. Just as good a few bucks cheaper. We're talking about $20 give or take here. I'd go that route first, test them and see what you think?

Another item that 'might" help with drainage/drying are these. I have them in my winter pac boots. If your boots have some room, I think you might like them?

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MB,

I only speak based on my personal experience.  I use the orange Superfeet insoles - because they were cheap - got 'em used and the REI Attic (now garage) sale - like $15.  But not because they were just cheap.  I have not used a lot of insoles, but when you compare these to a lot of others, the thing I note is the hard plastic rear foot bed.  That is what I feel helps take up a lot of the volume and cradles your heel.  The front is mostly flat, but takes up a decent bit of volume too.  In my experience, they are tough - had the same pair in and out of several pairs of boots, including the Chota's, for 5 years with minor wear and still hanging tough.  You can always find them on sale somewhere - like anything else.  REI has a great return policy and maybe wait for the 20% member sale (like the one that ends today...btw).  If they don't work for you, return for a refund - kinda like a free road test.  Those Caney Forks ain't cheap either, but you get what you pay for, right.  BTW...those Chota insoles make a great pattern for any new ones you get.  Cut to fit a bit big so you get a good interference fit and they won't budge.  YMMV.  As for the boots actually drying out....that's why it's call wet-footing.  Mine take days to dry (not as bad as the NRS Velocity...) and I always give them a dunk is some Mirazyme solution after a paddle to keep the odors down.

pd