I suspect many folks don't wear a PFD because they are uncomfortable. I tend to agree and that is why I went with an inflatable. After my recent "awkward moment" where I found myself most unexpectedly in the drink I can suggest their effectiveness first hand.

I always have it on and feel incomplete with out it on. Nice thing about it is I forget I have it on because it is so comfortable. I started out with a pull cord model. These are good but since I also use it on power boats I opted for a hydrostatic model when I decided that anyone on my boat had to wear a PFD so now I have 2. I wear the hydrostatic model whenever I am on the water. It will not activate due to rain, only water pressure will do the job. I have a mustang hydrostatic model and it is rated for offshore work with 35lbs of flotation. It is what the U.S. coast guard wears as well as many state DNR officers. Like I said you don't even know you are wearing it.

Price is a consideration. The pull cord models will run you about 100 bucks and the hydrostatic ones double that. The re-arm kit will also set you back. The re-arm for the hydrostatic was 80 bucks. They claim at least 5 years and there is a green circle letting you know you are good to go. Red is bad........

I had thought it would be prudent to have a re-arm kit with me but after becoming familiar with the model I have I think it not a must. The reason being is that there is an air stem that pops up more or less near your face when the breakaway zipper pops when it is armed. After letting out all the air to re-arm I decided to blow the bladder up and was surprised at just how few breaths it took. I'll hold onto the boat and blow it up in the unlikely event I ever dump twice on the same trip. Naturally it is a one way valve and needs to be depressed to release the air.

Anyway, this may be an option for some who, like me, detest the thought of wearing a bulky life jacket and probably would just set it aside. I was very glad to have had mine on as I was surprised at just how deep in the water I was until it inflated and popped me right up. Nice!

Preacher wrote on Jul 18^th, 2011 at 4:09pm:

Is it just me or does that paragraph seem to negate all the ones above it?

I wear my seatbelt all the time while I've worn a helmet just twice in my life. When I have my PFD on, it mean's I'm out of my comfort zone - afraid of what could happen. Buying a cycle is the first sign of insanity. Helmet, boots, leather to go with are only reminders that you are taking on a larger risk. Think of that next time you're in the shower. Got helmet? You could fall and drown ya-know!

Quote:


My feelings about PFD's are well known here. I respect other's choices even if I strongly disagree.

I have no death wish but my thought's on wearing a PFD have more to do with Preachers comment than saving my own skin.

I'd add this thought to his one. I would never want someone to lose their life trying to save mine because I got in a position I needed that PFD and didn't have it on.

A few weeks ago, 2 people drowned at the base of a small dam on the Huron River in Milford MI. Two high school guys in kayaks paddled up to the base even though the area is clearly marked as extremely dangerous. The got to close and were dumped and in the washing machine. One had a PFD on, but it wasn't fitted properly and was torn from him. The other didn't have one on at all.

There's a little park near there were people fish and picnic.
A 40 something local guy who knew the danger as he was an experienced kayak-er dove in and drowned trying to save them. One of the kids was rescued by other by-standers.

The selfless would be rescuer left a wife and children. The rescued teen lost his best friend and will forever have the guilt of knowing his poor decision along with his buddies cost one of them their lives and the life of the brave man who tried to respond.

That happens more often than not. Some brave soul dies, saving someone who either lacked the common sense to protect themselves or decided they would risk the odds.

Of course once in harms way, you never hear someone shout " It's all right, I'll accept the consequences of my actions, don't risk you life for me." More often than not, they're crying HELP louder than anyone else

IMHO there are things worse in this life than death. Living with the guilt of your actions or should I say non-actions would be for me, worse than dying itself.

Yellowbird wrote on Jul 18^th, 2011 at 10:00pm:

Heehee.  This illustrates the typical situation.  The older generation says, "Seatbelts?!?!?!  How dare the guberment force me to wear one!"  The younger generation says, "Hey, good idea.  A tool that lets me walk away from something that would kill the tool who rejects its use."  Occasionally someone demonstrates the need for the rule. 
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Heh, helmet in the shower.  Funny stuff db.  Completely & ridiculously invalid, but funny!


I think at the core is the misconception that we are only individuals.  That nobody depends on us.  That nobody cares about us.  That nobody would be affected by our untimely deaths.  Wholly solipsist & selfish.

M_M,

I get what your saying. I agree, nothing does take the place of common sense.

MI doesn't have any true White Water rivers, at least in the Lower Half. I believe there are a few in the Upper Peninsula.
The spot they drowned in even though marked as being a dangerous area and is turbulent compared to the rest of the area, still isn't what inexperienced people would consider White Water. Most flat water paddlers would never think it was so dangerous if not for the signs which are well posted there.
Like you, I also doubt the would be rescuer who died wearing the PFD was aware of what your talking about, or he wouldn't of went in there. From your post, it doesn't appear he was an " experienced" white water paddler but I don't know that for sure? Maybe being a Father he just acted on a parents instinct to protect a child.
I'm was not familiar with those conditions either, but your post changes that. I've made it this far in life by reading signs and giving them the respect they deserve.
Bottom line is the two teens used poor judgment and the brave but mis-guided rescuer payed for their mistake with his life.
I'd like to think that wearing a PFD is a sign that you have good judgment and think before you act.
  Your post proves that's only wishful thinking on my part as a PFD is no guarantee of survival in all conditions.
Still, for the vast majority of drowning incidents it's the prudent choice, especially so in the conditions we encounter in the BW/Q.
Now I know when to take it off IF I'm ever caught in such a predicament.
I feel the worst for the poor guy who drowned trying to help. I've been in that position in the Q, watching 3 guys struggle with only 1 wearing a PFD in turbulent/frigid May water.

I knew better than go out there solo but it took all of my common sense to control my natural urge to help someone that needed it. Thankfully in my story, they made it out alive.
Maybe they should mark the inside of PFD's with the following " No substitute for common sense".
Problem is 99% of the people who's lack of common sense/sound judgment got them in trouble would tell you THEY have it and put the blame on someone/thing other than themselves
 

Quote:


I'm sure the people looking for you will appreciate that
As a practical matter, it costs a lot of money to search for missing people. As a tax payer I'd appreciate if if you wear a brightly colored PFD so it makes it easier to find your stiff STUPID ass if that's the case

Quote:


Well fellow tax payer, how do you feel about this scenario?
I go without a PFD, I don't die, but do to exposure/submerging/etc, I wind up a vegetable, needing full time care for the rest of my life.
No-one has that good of insurance, so eventually the tax payers will bear the burden. Yes, I paid taxes to, but the average person doesn't pay anywhere near enough in taxes to even put in dent long term health care.
So then what? Are you okay with the government raising your taxes because they need the revenue to take care of people like me?
Yes, even with a PFD I could end up in the same boat, but don't you think a little prevention is worth a pound of cure, especially when the price of the cure is getting unbearable?

Is personal freedom/choice more important than the toll a poor decision makes on society in general and your family loved ones in particular

wally wrote on Jul 20^th, 2011 at 3:01pm:



If I didn't know better I would say that was very LIBERAL of you

Quote:


I don't really think being a Liberal is a bad thing, at least not all the time
I was just having a little fun with Wally.
I must admit I'm a little confused by his stand on paying for someones poor decision?
I know he despises the " Nanny State" mentality. Seems like being willing to let the State pay for my freedom of choice when it goes to hell by being willing to pay extra in taxes is encouraging the "Nanny mentality" 

He must mean taxing the " rich " not us middle class peasants

Nothing like a discussion on pfd to get comments.  Even if it is the 5th time, it has come up.  To wear or not to wear, that is the question.
Westwood

"scoff 1 (skf, skôf)
v. scoffed, scoff·ing, scoffs
v.tr.
To mock at or treat with derision.
v.intr.
To show or express derision or scorn.
n.
An expression of derision or scorn."


hell, I scoff at everybody, whether they are wearing thier grey pfd or not...........

On another note: I would be watching for the birds rather than a colored piece of clothing. Just Sayin and yes it makes me sad!

Everything breaks down doesn't it!

They definitely will wear out/lose bouyancy over time.  How long depends on the type of foam, exposure to heat & UV, and how you use it.  That being said, most outfitters don't buy new ones as often as they buy canoes.

Not that I am recommending any one brand, there are lots of kayak style PFD manufacturers out there due to the popularity of that paddle sport right now; I run a Stohlquist and have been happy with it including its construction and fit. Ran a "Stern" before and I am amazed(if I can remember that far back) at how much cooler it is and then there is the mobility and fit!

Sorry, this might seem off topic but we're here The heat/hot thing is maybe the really hiccup in this area. Being over heated plan sucks and is really pretty hard on yah; just as bad cold or worse in my book. Acclimation makes all the difference in the world. I am in the heat everyday, no AC at home either; I am acclimated. For those that get AC'd everyday all day your not. So dawning another layer when your hot and not use to the work gets yah hotter; go swimming, wet a bandana and put on the your neck, drink the water, and don't forget to practice the wet entry especially if your soloing.

Oh yah PFDs are usually on sale at the end of the season.

I wonder if the folks that didn't come home this year practiced their wet entry?

marlin55388 wrote on Jul 29^th, 2011 at 8:46pm:

Well, I hit the "wall" this year on my WCPP.  I literally reach the point on the last day of portaging (9 ports that day with the longest being 168 rods) where I could no longer put one foot in front of the other.  After days of not having a dry stitch of clothing on (I SWEAT, I don't perspire), knocking back well over a gallon of water a day while moving (and more at the campsite overnight) I reached the point where I just had to lay down and rest for a while before I could proceed.  You know its time when nausea and dizziness hits you that you've reached your limit.  So despite being wet, despite frequent plunges, despite the fact that I get out and walk for miles in the heat when its 95 or hotter outside, sometimes you are going to reach the point where you are all in.  I guess the tipping point could have been that I did part of the last portage in pouring rain ... meaning the humidity was REALLY high, so I wasn't sweating enough to keep cool.

Luckily I was traveling with a partner on this trip.  He was a great help in finishing the last portage and setting up camp.  My goal was to strip to my skivvies and walk out into neck deep water and just stay there a while, which I did.  I then strung my nylon string hammock and laid out in the shade for an hour with breezes blowing on me.

Yet, after all that I still had liquid running out both ends after I got up an hour later.  I went to "nap" in my tent at 5:00 and arose to grab a snack at 9:30 and went right back to bed.  Still, fully rested the next morning, I was again exhausted by the time we finished a 6 hour paddle to the take-out (the paddle in was more like 3 hours ... it was WINDY!).

So, be careful of the heat.  It can grab you quick and lay you low!  BUT, I was wearing my PFD all the time!

dd

BTW:  We shared a lunch stop with the park portage clearing crew on the way out.  The leader shared that he had made the sat. phone call back to park headquarters concerning whether or not they should fly him out because of heat exhaustion.  Luckily his younger counterpart's mom had required him to pack some electrolytes for just such a problem, so that "saved" a plane ride for the leader.  The leader was seasoned veteran of the park service and probably wasn't 50.  So, it wasn't my advanced age or physical condition alone that put me over the edge.  From now on, I'm packing electrolytes!

Cool DD!

DentonDoc wrote on Jul 29^th, 2011 at 10:09pm:


I found that "wall" 2 weeks ago during the Death March out of Delahey.  It was 90, sunny, humid, with no wind.  I drank 2 liters of water before starting and had 2 liters with me.  Not enough.  I literally fell over with the canoe on the second leg as I reached the little pond midway on the 1.5 mile leg.  The canoe hit a 2-in birch sapling left of the trail dead on.  It must have bent away and then snapped back, sending me and the canoe to the ground.  Can't recall the last time that ever happened.  Just before the pond, I reach several rock boulders/faces that needed to be climbed up and over.  But when I tried to take the canoe off to rest, the yoke pad caught my head and next thing I knew the canoe was banging off the rocks and I was sprawled on my back to the left of the trail.  Thankfully, nothing was busted or sprained.  When I reached the pond, I sat in the shade for a good twenty min and even after the rest, my heart rate was still 120 beats per minute and I was sweating like a pig.  Ate a little trail mix, drank some more water, and triple portaged the rest of the Death March.  I recall paddling towards the last portage into Conmee and I could barely move my arms to move the yak paddle...really weird feeling. 

It took me 8 hours to reach Suzanette, 6.5 hours was on the portage trail.  At the campsite, I unloaded the gear, sat in the water for a bit, then sat in my camp chair in the shade for about 75 minutes, just staring and soaking in the scenery.  Never felt dizzy or nauseous, just hot, very tired, and relieved the day was almost over.  Finally ate a PBJ sandwich with some gatorade and felt a little better.  Just before heading into the tent for the night, I recorded on my digital voice recorder I bring on solo trips: "Today was a bitch.  Hardest damn day I've ever had canoeing.  I'm 2/3 thirds of the way done with this tough physical trip...not sure I'm enjoying it that much.  I'm very achy, shoulders and back.  Not sure I'll ever do that Death March again without the boys or a partner."

As for my PFD, I didn't wear it all that day...I was too dang hot.

solotripper wrote on Aug 1^st, 2011 at 3:33pm:


Hi, ST.  I actually bought this vest based on a recommendation I think you provided last year.  It is quite comfortable and I like the velcro pockets for a small ditch kit.  Still, on most paddling days, I don't wear it.  Now, it is right behind my seat should anything go awry.  When the wind and waves are up, I'll put it on.  It is indeed a good, inexpensive, lightweight pfd for canoe trips.

solotripper wrote on Aug 1^st, 2011 at 6:53pm:


My seatbelt comes in handy "after the fact".   Copper turns around...seatbelt goes on!   I think MN is up to about $120-150 for no belt.

We agree solo....just letting my inner Dorkus shine.

mastertangler wrote on Aug 3^rd, 2011 at 2:15am:

Folks should take heed.  It's exactly this sentiment that murmurs in the back of my mind whenever someone suggests there's a time to not wear a PFD while paddling.

Glad you're still kicking & on your terms!

Swimming with a PFD is awesome!  Turn it upside down, put it on like shorts!  You can just sit out there & bob around.  Toss a ball!  Bring the fishing rod and get towed around!  It's awesome, I highly recommend it.