25 How long does it take to do a portage? (Read 23127 times)
solotripper
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Re: How long does it take to do a portage?
Reply #10 - Nov 30th, 2009 at 8:29pm
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QPassage wrote on Nov 30th, 2009 at 4:20pm:
Hmm, this might help you out MP.  Might need to take a lady friend along to work it all out.   Grin
Our group of seven really tackled this portage. The three guys did it naked. We were in a groove and wanted to do all of our portages in one trip. The ladies doubled up with packs. We packed fairly light that trip.
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qp


THAT might explain who lost the "herb" and pipe on the other post Roll Eyes
  
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Wenonah Rider
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Re: How long does it take to do a portage?
Reply #11 - Nov 30th, 2009 at 9:54pm
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Getting back to the original question, my only additional input is that theory and reality are in two totally different universes kind of like virtual vs reality. Each trip I take I learn to plan more for the unexpected. Enjoy next years trip MP. Maybe our theories can be discussed further at Canoe Copia while we wait for the reality of next year's trip to come to pass

WR
  
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Magicpaddler
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Re: How long does it take to do a portage?
Reply #12 - Nov 30th, 2009 at 10:36pm
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What I am trying to do is to find what works best for me.  I already know I do not like carrying more than 60 LB.  Adjustment of the pack can not only make it more comfortable but also make it take less time to cross a portage.  My  rout is 2.69 miles which is longer than a single trip across a portage.  I am trying to simulate a long double portage maybe near the end of the day. I have some other changes to test but I do not think I will see how comfortable it is to do naked ( a lot of multifora rose! Ouch).
Well it keeps me in shape anyhow.
Magicpaddler
  
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QPassage
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Re: How long does it take to do a portage?
Reply #13 - Dec 1st, 2009 at 1:58am
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MP

I would base it on my walking time on a fairly level wooded (not Path) walk.
So at 2.69 miles that =  170438.4 inches.  My stride is 27 inches, divide that into the 170438.4 = 6312.5333 steps.  Now for the grade factor I would cut my stride by .33 ( less 8.91 inches) for grades 5% to 10% that would make my stride at 18.09 inches Any grade over 10%  I would cut it by .66 ( less 17.82 inches), that would be 9.18 inches per step.  At a 5-10% grade you’ll still be walking pretty much in a straight line. Over 10% going uphill or down I suspect you will be making much shorter steps or walking from side to side.  I figure my steps usually 1 per second so at a level grade it would take me about 1.7534815 hours to walk it.
Now take into account the grade changes from typo maps.  Figure the percentages of different grades and you should be pretty close.   This is a figure I use hiking in the Gorge and the only things that really throw it into a default are mud, water, pictures, and snack breaks.   Don’t take a camera or snacks and you’ve already cut that default by 50%. Wink

qp
  
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Old Salt
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Re: How long does it take to do a portage?
Reply #14 - Dec 1st, 2009 at 1:24pm
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QPassage wrote on Dec 1st, 2009 at 1:58am:
MP

I would base it on my walking time on a fairly level wooded (not Path) walk.
So at 2.69 miles that =  170438.4 inches.  My stride is 27 inches, divide that into the 170438.4 = 6312.5333 steps.  Now for the grade factor I would cut my stride by .33 ( less 8.91 inches) for grades 5% to 10% that would make my stride at 18.09 inches Any grade over 10%  I would cut it by .66 ( less 17.82 inches), that would be 9.18 inches per step.  At a 5-10% grade you’ll still be walking pretty much in a straight line. Over 10% going uphill or down I suspect you will be making much shorter steps or walking from side to side.  I figure my steps usually 1 per second so at a level grade it would take me about 1.7534815 hours to walk it.
Now take into account the grade changes from typo maps.  Figure the percentages of different grades and you should be pretty close.   This is a figure I use hiking in the Gorge and the only things that really throw it into a default are mud, water, pictures, and snack breaks.   Don’t take a camera or snacks and you’ve already cut that default by 50%. Wink

qp


Huh Huh Huh Huh Huh
See, it ain't rocket science!! Shocked Just do the math... Grin
  
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Snow_Dog
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Re: How long does it take to do a portage?
Reply #15 - Dec 1st, 2009 at 2:23pm
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How long does it take to do a portage?

To figure it precisely, I check my watch when I step out of the canoe upon arrival at the portage.  I check my watch again when I paddle away from the other end. 

End Time - Start Time = Elapsed Time  Wink  It's over when it's over and not before.

Seriously, though, I just don't give it that much thought, especially on portages I've never travelled.  There's too many potential variables.

Mad_Mat's system seems like a good rule of thumb to me if you're goal is just to make sure you aren't planning your days too aggressively.
  
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Ancient_Angler
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Re: How long does it take to do a portage?
Reply #16 - Dec 1st, 2009 at 4:30pm
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This turns out to be way too complex for me. I figure, long portages take longer than short portages. Of course, if I've been across a trail before, I have a pretty good idea. But things change. Consider, for example, the change from the south side of Kashashapiwi after the beaver dam got removed. Before I got there, I knew the dam was gone and could take that into account. But suppose you get somewhere and did not know of a change in the trail? Yet, I guess science can be applied to whatever.

Tim
  
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paddlerpj
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Re: How long does it take to do a portage?
Reply #17 - Dec 1st, 2009 at 4:40pm
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Yikes!  We just generally plan on doing 10-15 miles a day and if the winds are favorable and the portages easy we're done early and if not we're done late or we reconsider....
  
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intrepid_camper
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Re: How long does it take to do a portage?
Reply #18 - Dec 1st, 2009 at 4:51pm
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I used to be able to do...not sure it is still relevant 'cuz I am slowing down...one McKenzie map east/west per day, or north/south in a day and a half.  Wink
Not surprised Magic is getting this all worked out...he IS an analytical type scientist by trade.  He also can charge through a bushwack like a bull moose while the rest of us are pussy-footin' around the tough spots  Grin
  
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solotripper
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Re: How long does it take to do a portage?
Reply #19 - Dec 1st, 2009 at 8:38pm
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 This is very entertaining! I'm not sure you can "calculate" travel or paddle time other than in a very general way? Too many variables, at least in my experience.
 
Weight is a reasonable "doable", as well as physical conditioning for the trip. Efficient portaging techniques helps as well.

 I'm not sure planning using a "known" route that you use frequently will translate to the varying portage conditions you encounter on a trip?
 
Your body adapts to the load it's put under over time. it becomes more "efficient" at doing the same task repeatedly. Even a shorter route with lots of up/downs, boot sucking mud, or slick rocks will tire you faster than your longer familiar training route that doesn't feature those obstacles.

 I plan on "underestimating" my travel time, figuring you can always push on if your up too it and the conditions are favorable. I'd rather add a unexpected lake or layover day, than have to push hard to get out for a scheduled pick-up or depart time.

I go on what my body is telling me. I like an early start, before 7 am at least. I take a short lunch unless the winds are against me and then I might take a longer break and paddle later. Generally by 4 pm, I'm in campsite mode. I'll paddle later or take a hard portage late, especially if it puts me on a nice lake I have a layover day planned.

You can calculate/figure all you want, but we all know Murphy's Law will have a say in our best figured plans Wink Worse case you go from Murphy's to FUBAR, in which case you call for the MARINES( JIMBO) on your little SPOT gizmo Embarrassed

I look forward too the day when I can travel when I feel like it, layover whenever I want, and come out when I run out of food.
 
Unfortunately in today's economy THAT day is getting pushed farther and farther down the road for me Cry
 
I'm sure MP will get it all worked out too his satisfaction before his trip.
It will be interesting too read his trip report and see how close theory and reality are :question
 
Hopefully he won't be disappointed, and we'll be enlightened an/or amused Wink
 

  
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