I have long decided that Americans had lost the ability to disagree with dignity and respect, to allow others to hold differing opinions, interpretations and conclusions without resorting to personal attacks, character assassination and ridicule.

Practiced at their worse, partisan politics and religious bickering (or is that partisan bickering and religious politics?) are killing this country.

But discussions like this one give me hope.

I'm impressed with the knowledge, the respect and the clarity of the  arguments demonstrated here thus far -- by those on both sides (jobs v. environment) as well as those who acknowledge some indecision.

Not to lay it on too thick (I prefer my syrup light), but ... very nice, and refreshing, too. Kudos to QJ founders and moderators, as well as veteran members.

...

Having said that, I was interviewing author Rick Bass once about the purpose of wild places, which to him and others is simply to exist, untouched, as a testimony to God's creation or Mother Nature's mystery (or whatever your belief system).

If I remember correctly, there was a proposal floated by President Bush to balance the federal budget by selling some national forest land, including a few parcels of Kentucky's coveted Daniel Boone National Forest. When I talked to him, Bass had recently finished a book about ANWR ("Caribou Rising") and of course he was fighting -- as he is always fighting -- to protect his beloved Yaak Valley in Montana.

... all them, he said, untamed areas where "wild nature still possesses its own compass and grace."

It's tough to be a conservationist these days, he said, to argue the merits of forested areas and pristine waters in a world of hard currency. But the more complicated the world gets, the more important it is.

And then he gave me a quote I've held on to all these years: "With so many critical issues at play in the world, it might seem at times indulgent to be advocating for so elemental and increasingly unfamiliar a value as wildness. But there is hope, for the worse matters get in the larger world, the more we realize, I think, the spiritual value of free and untouched  landscapes, to which -- cribbing from a woman named Ellen Burns Sherman, over a hundred years ago -- we may return again and again, contrite prodigals from the task of an artificial life."

Admittedly, I'm not from Minnesota and do not have intimate knowledge of the area being targeted. Admittedly, too, I have a job and know not the desperation of being unemployed with mouths to feed (I was fortunate as a single father of two children to find a job two years ago when my company closed).

But let's not forget in this discussion that wild places have value -- intangible value, perhaps -- outside the worth of the minerals, timber and crude they hold.

-- kypaddler

kypaddler wrote on Dec 16^th, 2009 at 5:10am:


kypaddlle: I'm not sure about the proposed sale of USFS lands to balance the budget, but as I recall there was a preposal that the monies from such a sale would go to some sort of rural school funding :question Funding to replace lost source of money generated by timber sales for these shools...no logging = no $ dough $ The USFS is constantly exchanging or desposing (mostly aquireing) lands . Lands selected for these transactions are mostly small or isolated parcels. Some of these parcels are comepletly surounded by private land, so no one but the private land owner has access to these "public" lands. There is a federal program called "summer homes" in which a permit is issued to grant the recipient permission to build vacation type building on Taxpayer land. I think these lands are also selected for disposal, as the permittee is granted sole exclusive rights to occupy these taxpayer lands :question... any way, you might want to some background research into this program for interesting thought prevoking  :exclamation I'm attaching a photo showing some of this taxpayer timber that was saved from the saw Now, back to the origional  :question

kypaddler wrote on Dec 16^th, 2009 at 2:58pm:


kypaddler: I was researching a current land exchange deal between Lake County Mn. and the USFS today when I happened upon a bit of info you may be interested in... Under the current Obama admin., Govt. land is still being made available to private ownership   This federal land is curently under the "summer home" lease program to private owners, more interesting is that the govt. land preposed to be turned into private land is some of the very land that is predicted to become barren waste land if the polymet mine becomes functional     Either the private investers know something about this soon to be "toxic asset" that the rest of us don't know or the private investors don't put much faith into the  "hollywood" type doom and gloom movie starwatcher made mention of ....hummmmm,hummmmm, and double hummmmmmm :question. I don't know if this link will work, but if you do have intrest, try: (You need to Login or Register to view media files and links)    
skle = South Kawishiwi Land Exchange......now I am really wondering :exclamation

ps. don't know about the term yellow populars, herd em refered to by many other terms , but I have spent some time walking amongst scattered clumps of them in the "REDBIRD" down on the Dan'l Boone  

say.......I am starting to have some real concerns about potental damage to an already shaky real estate market ..damage possiably induced to land holders downstrean in the Kawishiwi water shed :question.   If a land invester was shopping for property, I can see how the "hollywood-like" movie implys certain real-estate is bound to have little to no value, and would someone seeking financing for such property find backing or be turned away due the "toxic asset"lable I am startingt to think the makers of this "holywood-like " film should be held accountable ........class action suit :question....

realy would like some imput 

thanks for the links db

Hey Wandering Scott, check this out...... (You need to Login or Register to view media files and links)

Maybe they could use your ideas.

Laurention Vision Partnership has been working with mining, government, business and community interests on the Mesabi Iron Range to demonstrate how the mining process can create land forms to accommodate the residents, the environment, and the economy of this region's promising future...Read more.

starwatcher