Man, I know I can be a pain the rear at times..........but in the best spirit of furthering the discussion

I am with you on trolling picking up active fish......no question about it.

I'm also with you on casting is probably the very best way to work a particular piece of structure (although I can follow a break line pretty dang well while trolling).

And I'm also with you on being able to "tease" neutral or even negative fish into nibbling by casting and retrieving.....lots more control.

But......(you knew that was coming didn't you) I also think I can get neutral and even negative fish to strike a trolled lure. It is called a reaction strike and I know Mr. Jax is very familiar with the concept. Whats nice about a trolled lure is that I can keep it in the strike zone for extended periods. Sooner or later while bumpin bottom a walleye is going to have to decide to get out of the way or smack the crap out of this obnoxious cisco that is so stupid as to disturb its repose.

Please be patient with me as I again present "what ifs" that seem on the face of it to be just purely for the sake of being disagreeable......that is not my intent.

I seldom if ever use loud colors/loud rattles in clear water even if I seek a reaction strike. On negative fish I prefer, and this is only my opinion, subtler colors and sounds. What I want is for that fish to not even know that lure is there until it is almost on top of it. It has but a second or two to make a decision. Loud colors/loud rattles let a fish "think" about it for to long IMO.

Of course the fascinating thing about fishing is there are days where either approach is the ticket to the exclusion of the other. Likely best to try both........I would be out of luck as I carry no loud colors at all to canoe country and I would just have to sit there as Jax says "Oh, I got another one" .

I agree with MT on this one. Yes on both counts, sometimes rattles good, sometimes not so good. The thing is, as fishermen, we do what has worked for us in the past. If you use rattles a lot, you will catch fish and say, its the rattles....why change, it works. This is of course true. Conversely, guys who don't like rattles are still catching fish, so they say, no, its better without rattles. The key is that you gotta try different things and constantly assess. The lure is really like a scanning or probing device. It gives you lots of info. One thing I often do, is that if a lure I'm using is just killing them, I remove it and try something else. For me its, hmm, wonder if this other lure will work as well? That's the fun part. Especially something new or even something very old...I'm sure a lot of you guys do the same thing. One thing I will say, again agreeing with MT and others, is that for the biggest fish around, I think no rattles will work better. This is said from experience. Rattles will pick off smaller fish, aggressive fish. Not to say big fish won't hit them, as I've caught lots of really nice fish using rattles, I'm talking about the biggest fish around. You can see this sometimes with smallies if you are fishing clear water from an elevated position, say a high shoreline bank. You cast of a floating rap say. Smaller fish will hit it almost any way you work the lure. The bigger fish sit underneath watching. Often times you can see that big fish and if you are more aggressive with the lure, it will sink out of site or even turn and swim directly away...I've found one of the best approaches in this situation is to cast out maybe near where you think the big guy is heading, but over a bit deeper water. Just let the lure sit. Thats it. Keep a tight line. Doesn't work all the time, but more often than not, whamo! The same approach can sometimes work even better with a jig. The rap will keep catching fish mind you, even some fairly big ones, but for that huge bruiser you can just barely see, cast a jig (bucktail or marabou in natural colours work best in this situation), and just let it sit on the bottom - again, keeping a fairly tight line is important. Works even better if you tip it with a small piece of worm. That big fish knows your jig is there, guaranteed. He'll just watch it, sometimes coming over and tilting down on it. Closer, closer....if you aggressively move you jig, especially after only a few seconds, nada. The fish is gone. Just let it sit. If you can stand it, this approach is deadly. After more than a minute or two, maybe just roll the jig an inch or two with a slow pull, never hopping it. Whamo!

Of course, this is just my experience. Lots of ways to catch fish. But this approach definitely works for the big ones.

Moonman.